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All of your complaints seem to be about the defaults. That's fine, but I don't see that it makes sense to switch distribution because you don't like the defaults, given that all the other options are available inside Debian and/or Ubuntu as well. There's Xubuntu, Lubuntu, Ubuntu GNOME, Kubuntu etc. all of which have different desktop environment defaults, enthusiastic developers who look after it. Some intend to switch to Mir, and some do not. Switching distribution because you don't like the main Ubuntu flavour's defaults is just fragmentation when there's no need for it. There may be plenty of valid reasons, but not liking the defaults is not one of them.

> Millions is spent on Ubuntu but seems like little makes it upstream.

I don't think you appreciate how much work does go upstream. Thousands of patches go upstream (eg. http://udd.debian.org/cgi-bin/ubuntu_usertag.cgi; and that's just stuff that went directly Debian and was tagged as such). Driver work for new hardware enablements go to the upstream kernel so that Ubuntu developers don't have to maintain it. And Canonical is upstream for a number of projects (eg. they pioneered faster boot speeds with upstart, which went into RHEL). You just don't see this in action because the community works, and work done in one distribution ends up in all the others. So you don't realise how much of the other distribution you're using involves work originally done in Ubuntu.



ripb "All of your complaints seem to be about the defaults."

Only one of five is a default issue and I even declared it a default issue and how I go around defaults.

1. Mir is a huge mistake (My opinion)

2. Unity (Well I am tiled window manager (i3) guy now so all DEs) I really don't like the flow of OS X and it is starting to really look more like OS X. DEFAULT an easily be changed.

3. Lack of community between the Linux ecosystem. Millions is spent on Ubuntu but seems like little makes it upstream.

4. Software Center. They need to just take OpenSUSE's one-click model and get rid of their current model of App Store and the horrible app model. (My model)

5. Their Developer SDK to "Write once, run everywhere." If I had a nickel for every time that was promised (Java looking at you) Once again OpenSUSE Build Service is the most underused Linux tool in the last decade


> 1. Mir is a huge mistake (My opinion)

Defaults. Kubuntu developers have said that they will not be using Mir. Thus I expect X/Wayland to be available in the repositories and used by default by alternative flavours.

> 2. Unity (Well I am tiled window manager (i3) guy now so all DEs) I really don't like the flow of OS X and it is starting to really look more like OS X. DEFAULT an easily be changed.

Defaults. Alternative Ubuntu flavours provide alternative DE defaults.

> 3. Lack of community between the Linux ecosystem. Millions is spent on Ubuntu but seems like little makes it upstream.

I addressed this separately.

> 4. Software Center. They need to just take OpenSUSE's one-click model and get rid of their current model of App Store and the horrible app model. (My model)

Defaults. You can use whichever front-end to apt you wish; Software Center is just the default. If there's an alternative available in Debian, Ubuntu has it. Examples: Synaptic, gdebi-gtk. Sure, they aren't complete replacements. But if a suitable Free alternative is written, I expect that it will be packaged in Debian and be available in Ubuntu.

> 5. Their Developer SDK to "Write once, run everywhere."

Defaults. You don't have to use their developer SDK (except perhaps for apps that will work on Ubuntu Phone through the default app store; but then other distributions have no answer to that, do they?). Traditional dependency and package -based development is still available and is not going away.

Ubuntu are adding to what was there previously. They are not replacing things, except that they are using their new stuff as the default. Your complaints are about what Ubuntu are doing; except that all the traditional stuff that other distributions have are still available. This is why your arguments still boil down to arguments about defaults.


How is any of this a default issue it is a philosophy issue:

1. Mir they shouldn't do this. Again Philosophy.

2. Unity they shouldn't follow OS X lead. Again Philosophy.

4. Software Center - It is where you BUY programs and magazines. It is not a default it is how they run the business. Again Philosophy.

5. SDK is another HUGE philosophy issue. This write for Ubuntu is not Linux friendly. Again Philosophy.


>Switching distribution because you don't like the main Ubuntu flavour's defaults is just fragmentation when there's no need for it.

What reason would you have to stay with Ubuntu if you don't like any of its defaults? If someone doesn't like Ubuntu's changes to Debian, but still uses Ubuntu, isn't that just fragmentation when there's no need for it?




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